VR6 Conversion: Can we make this thing fit.

[wjjr]

[VR6 vanagon]

I don't feel the loss of space where I raised the deck lid is such a huge issue. I think I can raise my entire bench seat to the height of the new deck lid and everything will be flat and level.
That will be a winter project when it's a bit cooler down here, but I will let you all know how it works. Fropm what I can see, it will work perfectly.

[SyncroGhia]

Good to hear it's back up and running again Rob

It's interesting to know that stock 3rd and 4th gears (along with the rest of the gearbox) will take 190bhp and 180ftlbs and live.

I don't think anything which needed replacing in your gearbox was as a result of the engine conversion (having chatted to Aidan), just the normal parts which suffer. Also.. going along with the theory that stock ratios will work on other petrol engines with bigger tyre/wheel combos seem to work.

Sorry you had to find out a day before you went on holiday!! Hope you had a good time anyway.

MG
_________________
T3 Syncro 16 S6 Westfalia Limey SOLD
T3 Syncro 6x6 SOLD
T3 RS6 Bluestar
T3 Tristar Syncro 16 SOLD
T3 Tristar Syncro RHD SOLD

[slobbo]

Well just had the gearbox rebuilt in mine and seems I was fed a load of smelly stuff regarding the gearbox. It is a bog standard 2.1 petrol gearbox
- AAN code with 4.86 final drive. built 10/12/85
- 7 teeth on pinion and 34 on the crown
- .85 4th gear
The box now has oiling plates in and will hopefully las a very long time.
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cheers

Rob
www.aircooledcrazy.com

[casey79westfalia]

Well ground clearence seems to be the main problem. My garage is not tall enough to accomidate anymore then the stock height. I have driven a good amount of vr's and they just run beautifully. I think I am going to go the tdi route as it just seems to work out better in the long run. I have considered the 1.8t as well but think that would cause more headache then the tdi.
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66 Westfalia
87 Westfalia Syncro "Phoenix"
88 Double Cab
76 Porsche 914
2014 Audi Q7
2010 Tdi Sportwagen

Currently looking for 62 Double Cab, 66 Westfalia Parts!
(Rear seat and pedestal, bumpers, mirrors)

http://www.baycountrymotors.com

My 87 Syncro Westfalia 1.8t Restoration

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=418933

"Do it the right way, or you'll pay for it"

[SyncroGhia]

[thummmper]

okay, so you have 700.00 worth of 3+4 gears, super diff, probably sold you bearings out of fear...limited slip or locker too? 2k, 2.5k$
or 1.5k$. for a trans you will burn.
you could space the cabin up or the suspension down to build more engine room. not easy trashing your CG.
Why are you in love with this engine again? theres a lot of large engines that deliver more power--most of them won't work, including this one.
my pal is struggling with the gp 10 bostig...struggling with the obvious flaws in equipment selection. economics dominated the list, and dimensions and thoroughness of kit fell dead last. It's so bad he just started working on it again after dropping it in november. It dont fit!

[dredward]

slobbo you have a nice van!!!!!!!!!! I pondered the vr6. When i was decideing on what to do the vr6 was at th top of my list. I even pondered the 3.2 v6 from a wrecked r32. I went with the 1.8t mainly cause it was done legally before me in California and i found a great deal on a 1.8t... Again good job, best of all it a VW

[slobbo]

Hi everyone. The Blue beast is mine. The engine doesn't fit in the hole and can't see how you could without the sump getting destroyed every time you went over a speed bump. Not great on a Syncro. The mounts in mine are huge though. I reckon the one on the NS is 6" in length. The engine lid has been custom made and the useable space around it is limited. I use it for the jack and tools.

I had the more common roof rack front on the roof but it had the rack cut out to enable the sunroof to open. I swapped the roof section with later one to improve economy. I got about 18mpg (on the motorway) out of it The new roof section improved the situation by a mpg or 2.

The engine performance is fabulous. You can take it up to the redline and it still has more to go. It cruises effortlessly at 70 mph. I try not to thrash it though as I know I will end up destroying the box.

It has had the gearbox rebuilt with stronger 3rd and 4th at different ratios. Don't know the ratios but I could probably work it out. If you put one of these in without the modifications and strengthening I reckon the gearbox would implode. It needs the ratio change to make it cruise at the right revs.

I have put AVO adjustable dampers in the back which has helped with the handling. I found the stock ones were a bit soft and the van wallowed a bit. The engine is a heavy beast as it has a cast iron block (I believe) and doesn't help the handling.

The engine protrudes considerably in mine. So much so the interior was modified to fit. The rock and roll bed is higher. Not enough that it looks weird or causes problems. The interior in mine is a custom job and is the best interior from a use perspective I have seen and used (and I have had a few vans).

I have more info and pictures on www.aircooledcrazy.com . If you want some more specific pictures let me know.
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cheers

Rob
www.aircooledcrazy.com

[James 93SLC]

[djbside]

Why couldn't you lower the engine at the mounts to get the Deck Lid to sit flat... Then either shorten (custom) the Oil Pan or Raise the suspension to gain the lift back?

Maybe a combo of all 3 things... Lower the motor, shorten the Pan, lengthen the suspension...
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Brandon...'83 Westy "Rose"

[SyncroGhia]

[J Charlton]

If oil pans are the issue in road clearance, has anyone used a dry sump solution with a conversion? I've often wondered about this but I don't recall anyone writing about using it.
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NAHT hightop availability May 18 2023 -
Bend Oregon - for Oregon, California- (7 tot , 3 available), Kennewick Wa (6 tot, 1 available), Small Car Performance Fife Wa. (7 tot 4 avail ), Fairbanks Alaska (1 tot 0 avail)
Future availability TBD : Springfield Mass. Staunton Va, Florida, Colorado, Grand Junction Co., SLC probably late 2024

[MarkWard]

[James 93SLC]

[D Clymer]

A few years ago I saw a Vanagon in a local wrecking yard with a VR6 installed below the stock engine cover. The oil pan was literally only a few inches off the ground. The project had been abandoned and sold off to the wrecking yard, so obviously the previous owner had run out of good ideas.

I think the only way a VR6 would fit cleanly into a Vanagon would be to lay it over like VW did with the diesel inline four. As mentioned, this would require a custom oil pan and possibly a custom intake manifold, but it would allow this great engine to fit the available space in the Vanagon engine bay. Anyone want to tackle this one?

David

[J Charlton]

I think that the entire conversation of whether or not to raise a deck lid really should be viewed in terms of the actual amount of space lost in doing so. The approximate math is this - if we say that the rear deck area is roughly 4 feet by 2 1/2 feet that gives 12 square feet, if we were to raise the deck lid by 3 inches, or 1/4 of a foot, we would then have taken up a volume of 4 X 2.5 X .25 = 2.5 cubic feet. Not a lot of space.
Certainly not enough space to either accept or reject an engine for conversion based on it alone.
Personally, I'm looking into using a more modern TDI engine for my next conversion, I understand that a more upright installation is better, if so, so be it. I don't think that the entire lid will have to be raised 3" either, but even if it did, inasmuch as I'll be gaining about 13' X 5' X 2' = 130 cubic feet (all measures approximate) of volume by adding a hightop, the sacrifice of losing 2.5 cubic feet to be able to install the engine of my choice seems to be a very small loss.
Actually the 130 cu ft is a bit misleading - probably just the volume of the hightop aft of the hole (in the roof) and the forward storage should be considered. So it would be about 5X 4 X 2 (aft) + 3 X 4 X 2 (forward) totalling 64 cubic feet - still plenty of additional volume to accomodate lots and lots of stuff.
If the rear deck being raised meant that the seat had to be raised , well the space under the seat is storage anyway, so there would just be a bit more of it.
I would always opt to give up interior volume as opposed to lowering the road clearance. Too much investment in re-powering to risk anything hitting an unnecessarily low engine part.
_________________
NAHT hightop availability May 18 2023 -
Bend Oregon - for Oregon, California- (7 tot , 3 available), Kennewick Wa (6 tot, 1 available), Small Car Performance Fife Wa. (7 tot 4 avail ), Fairbanks Alaska (1 tot 0 avail)
Future availability TBD : Springfield Mass. Staunton Va, Florida, Colorado, Grand Junction Co., SLC probably late 2024

[James 93SLC]

[SyncroGhia]

I guess the engine could have been mounted lower in the shell but as with all syncros, ground clearance is important.

I've managed to get a 2.5TDi 5 cyl into my Syncro 16 without having to raise the lid and without losing much ground clearance. I only dropped it an extra 20mm from stock.

The roof section at the front is a factory piece and came on late Westfalias inc the California and Atlantic and is meant to work with a sunroof. They're supposed to good for more mpg. I had one on Limey when I first fitted the roof but wanted the more storage space and was prepared to sacriface the mpg.

MG
_________________
T3 Syncro 16 S6 Westfalia Limey SOLD
T3 Syncro 6x6 SOLD
T3 RS6 Bluestar
T3 Tristar Syncro 16 SOLD
T3 Tristar Syncro RHD SOLD

[edgood1]