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Picked up a '67 with dual-port, upgrade plans
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stan_tichomirov
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 2:01 pm    Post subject: Picked up a '67 with dual-port, upgrade plans Reply with quote

Hello,

I finally picked up another Beetle, http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=571905

It has a running dual-port in it which seems stock, AS41 case with 8mm studs, 040 heads, stock valvetrain, dual Kadrons, cheap 1 3/8" header and single quiet pack. Seems to be running pretty well so far.

I'm thinking of getting gauges for it to start watching how it responds to speed, temperature and changes. Also considering installing 1.4 rockers.

Once I do take it apart, I'd like to try re-using whatever parts I have now and getting more power out of them. If everything checks out I'm thinking of using thick wall 92mm cylinders, get a valve job on the stock valves, have single HD or dual springs installed, getting a 69mm counterweight crankshaft, lightening the flywheel and balancing crank/stock rods/flywheel/stock pressure plate and pully that's on there now. I'm thinking of giving it high'ish compression of around 9.0:1 and using an FK-41 or FK-42 cam. Goal is to have a fairly inexpensive engine that would have some grunt and rev healthy and stay cool cruising on the freeway at 70MPH.

Does this seem like a reasonable plan? Here is what I'm working with:

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I know the tin and shroud need help, that's on the short list of things to do.

Stan
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stan_tichomirov
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 04, 2013 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Leaning towards using 94mm machine-in cylinders -- same cost, more displacement. Acquired a 69mm counter weighted DMS crank, and set aside $1,000 budget for now.

So, what I have:

Running dual-port -- AS41 case, 040 heads, stock pressure plate/flywheel
69mm DMS crank
Pair of Kadrons with 28mm vents
1 3/8" header with single quietpack

What I need:

94mm pistons/cylinders (AA?)
Cam -- Web 163 or Engle 110 with 1.1:1 rockers, or FK-42 with 1.4:1 rockers. Compression of 8.5:1 to 9.0:1.
Clutch -- will stock pressure plate hold up to 100HP?
Deep sump
Case/head machining, flywheel 8-doweled and lightened, valve job, single HD or dual valve springs
Oil pump. I can use an OEM 30mm pump/filter combo to save money, or go for full flow. Need to decide here.

I like the Vintage Speed Equal Length exhaust, I would like to run that. I will not need heater boxes.

Stan
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

how's the project? I have a 2165 with standard rods heads flywheel, 1.4,dual springs,1700lbs, 40hpmx, fk42 cam, I need carburize
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stan_tichomirov
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2013 3:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pulled the engine yesterday. 3/4 head has cracked valves, heads are no go. Stripped it down to shortblock and couldn't find the torque-meister tool to remove flywheel, so took it to machinist as-is.

Case does not have inserts in all holes for some reason, so we'll probably open it up for 90.5s, hopefully it checks out fine. Have a 69mm DMS crank we'll try to use. Will reuse rods, shop rebuilds them in house. Probably use stock pressure plate, have the flywheel 8-dowled, lightened and have it all spun together. Found a new Web 163 in the garage from 2008 -- score, I thought it was sold. Cleaned the Kads, they look fine.

Will need heads, may get 044s with 40x35 valves. Trying to stay fairly low budget. Around 8.2:1, maybe 32mm vents, reuse the 1 3/8" header with single quiet pack -- should work out okay, right?

Will post a few pics in a bit.

Stan
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stan_tichomirov
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2013 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pictures from tear-down.

1/2 side:

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3/4 side. Probably ran lean?

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Short block:

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Tins soaking in oven cleaner:

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Car in the air:

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Kads. Air cleaner stud broke off on 1/2 side carb. Have 28mm vents, 55 idles, 150 airs, haven't looked at the mains yet.

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POS EMPI header. Fits alright, surprisingly does not leak.

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Stan
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Matthew
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 7:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like those lawn mower air filters they had stuck in the heater outlets on the fan shroud.

The cracks between the valves are pretty common and don't necessarily hurt anything. If there are no other problems with the heads, you may be able to freshen them up and re-use them.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 8:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That engine has been worked on before. It has been decked and the CR probably increased. From the picture it looked like it had around .050-.060 dh. That and the engine block is pretty clean as is. The flywheel looks lightened. Consider a set of Tims super stocker 37x32s. They work well on small displacement and mild cams. 189/head. That will work fine with your 1 3/8 header. A merge will work better but its ok to use for now with smaller valves. The 163 cam will work well with the set up. Id aim for upper 8 CR tbh. See if the case savers ( if any) came out with the head studs? If not, its a good time to put them in when disassembled. Get a new glandnut.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you guys. No case savers came out that I know of. Some studs without inserts did take some effort to remove but all came out fine. I'm somewhat paranoid when removing studs, hopefully the case is useable. Did some AS41 cases come like this, with only 4 inserts on each side? Weird.

I'll get new heads, easier that way. I can save the good head for later, and use the cracked one for practicing removing valves, etc. I'm thinking of staying with single HD springs since it's a street engine, and running stock rockers with stronger shafts. Assuming the deck height comes out similar to what it was, I can get non-stepped heads with 50cc in the chambers which will put me around 8.5:1 -- does that sound fairly safe? Car is a full weight '67 with what I assume is stock gearing, and it will see some freeway driving when I take it to work sometimes (55 miles each way). We are at sea level and I use 91 octane Chevron, with all our fuel having at least 10% ethanol in it.

Thank you,

Stan
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

8.5:1 is great, you can even go 8.78:1. Make SURE deck height is .040-.070". Don't forget to lighten the flywheel, it will wake it up!
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stan_tichomirov
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 3:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds good John, thank you.

More Easy-Off and scrubbing. Tins, got most of the yellow off:

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Shroud. I will probably cover shroud and tins in ROR-15.

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Stuff along with an engine stand I scored yesterday for $40 (had to scrub it, too):

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Fun.

Stan
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 1:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Still waiting on the machine shop, I forgot how long these things take sometimes.

Finished shroud and tins. I covered them with POR-15 rust prevention goodness, then sprayed it with POR-15 Blackcote. We'll see how they hold up.

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Stan
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 1:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FYI, your generator is installed 90 degrees off. Rotate it 90 degrees CW.

The way it is now the cooling slot to send air to cool the generator, is blocked off, and the generator will overheat. FWIW.

When you take it out, make sure the open slot in the backing plates lines up with the slot on the shroud, and you'll understand what I'm referring to.
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stan_tichomirov
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you! Have not payed attention to that so far, much appreciated.

Stan
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have the Kadrons apart and could use a suggestion for jetting. They have 55 idles, 130 mains and 150 airs on 28mm venturis. I'm aiming for an 1835cc with 40x35 valves and would prefer to try reusing my 1 3/8" exhaust at least in the beginning due to cost. Will jetting be safe as is? I could also try 30mm vents with 135 mains or 32mm vents with 145 mains but I'm not sure my exhaust can support it.

Stan
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Run the 28/55/125 for now. Get the engine broken in and running well, then you have a baseline to compare changes to. I'd think 30/55/135 would work well.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 8:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you John, sounds like a good plan.

Stan
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 2:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stan_tichomirov wrote:
Leaning towards using 94mm machine-in cylinders -- same cost, more displacement. Acquired a 69mm counter weighted DMS crank, and set aside $1,000 budget for now.

So, what I have:

Running dual-port -- AS41 case, 040 heads, stock pressure plate/flywheel
69mm DMS crank
Pair of Kadrons with 28mm vents
1 3/8" header with single quietpack

What I need:

94mm pistons/cylinders (AA?)
Cam -- Web 163 or Engle 110 with 1.1:1 rockers, or FK-42 with 1.4:1 rockers. Compression of 8.5:1 to 9.0:1.
Clutch -- will stock pressure plate hold up to 100HP?
Deep sump
Case/head machining, flywheel 8-doweled and lightened, valve job, single HD or dual valve springs
Oil pump. I can use an OEM 30mm pump/filter combo to save money, or go for full flow. Need to decide here.

I like the Vintage Speed Equal Length exhaust, I would like to run that. I will not need heater boxes.

Stan


94mm pistons/cylinders (AA?)
You'll need insets at all stud location, so you'll may want to consider sticking with 90.5's
Cam -- Web 163 or Engle 110 with 1.1:1 rockers, or FK-42 with 1.4:1 rockers. Compression of 8.5:1 to 9.0:1.
Clutch -- will stock pressure plate hold up to 100HP?
Aircooled.net has a HD Bus Pressure Plate that should do the job.
Deep sump
Case/head machining, flywheel 8-doweled and lightened, valve job, single HD or dual valve springs
Oil pump. I can use an OEM 30mm pump/filter combo to save money, or go for full flow. Need to decide here.
Go for full flow with a 26mm Berg O-ring Pump, Oil pumps I got were loose in the case,
so that's why I got the Berg O-ring Pump, and pull all the plugs to clean ALL the Galleys

I also got the Berg Stainless Line kit, I bought the blue hose kit first, but didn't dig it.
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stan_tichomirov
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Case, crank, rods, flywheel are still at the machine shop, along with a new Kennedy Stage 1 pressure plate. Rotating parts will all be spun together. Got some new parts, thank you John for the help and lightening-fast shipping, you rock as always. Thank you to Jeff at Kaddie Shack as well. Finally, some new fun work to do.

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Stan
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

500-420 Chinese heads with 51cc chambers. Couple of questions: I'm thinking of smoothing out edges from machining inside the ports, will that hurt anything? Same with sharp edges above valve seats in the chambers -- will those cause hot spots and should I smooth them out?

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Stan
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stan_tichomirov
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 05, 2014 9:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Case has been align-bored, had missing inserts installed, full-flowed and cut for 90.5s (I'm using thick-wall 92s):

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Spent some time with a Dremel on one of the heads, smoothing out edges in the ports and polishing the exhaust port a little:

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Stan
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