CB merged header VS AA sidewinder

[vugbug68]

Looking to up my header size to 1-5/8" on my 2109

Cant decide between the CB with my Bugpack hideaway muffler
http://www.cbperformance.com/product-p/3658.htm

Or the AA system that comes with a muffler
http://aapistons.com/collections/sidewinders/products/aa-sidewinder-ex-system-1-5-8-w-muffler

I've heard the AA system is loud

My current set up is a Berg 1-1/2", I like the sound I just think 1-5/8" will perform better

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71 Super
66 Corvair
69 Baja Bug

[bugguy1967]

You have to tell us whether you're after performace or sound. For performance, the best way to know FOR SURE is to either dyno test or invest in a wideband. The wideband will let you know if the exhaust is more efficient or not for your particular engine combination. No one can actually tell you what exhaust works best unless they actually have or had the same combo as you and have tested.

Weld a bung onto your current system, tune it, pull the exhaust off and install your new system with an O2 sensor bung, test that one. If you need to richen up certain areas, it flows better. If your jetting is too rich, put your old one back on.

[jpaull]

The AA is "louder" cause it has a performance type muffler. Your running a quiet pack style muffler that is well....quiet..... Its not a performance muffler in any way.

If you like the Hide-A-Way style, I would spend $50 more then that AA setup you mentioned and get the same thing in Stainless from Carcraft:

http://carcraftstore.com/sidewinder158exhaustsystem.aspx

You will definitely notice a difference in power from what you have now. For $50 more, you get something that doesn't rust and turn to crap. Its so much nicer to work with. $350 for a complete stainless system is a great deal.
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[email protected] MPH 1/4 Mile & 8.1 @ 83.7MPH in 1/8 Mile with Mild Type 1 VW Mag Case 2234cc commuter engine in stock weight bug w/only .491 total lift(CB2292 Cam), 42x37 heads, 48idf's, Street tires, Belt on, Mufflers, Pump gas, video of the run here: https://youtu.be/M3SPqMOKAOg

Transmission by MCMScott:
Rhino case, Klinkenberg 4.12, Superdiff, 002 mainshaft with 091 first idler. Weddle 1.48 Third & 1.14 Fourth.

[Glenn]

[quote="jpaull"Your running a quiet pack style muffler that is well....quiet..... Its not a performance muffler in any way. [/quote]
That's a generalization that's not true for every quiet pack.

Gene Berg GB-933S 1-5/8" merged, GB-971A-2M dual muffler

This was on for less than a day. It was loud, obnoxious and had less bottom end than the dual QPs.

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Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
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[jpaull]

Not a fair comparison that your making. You have TWO quiet packs. Once you give your exhaust that much space to flow its not much of a restriction.

Force all your exhaust through ONE quiet pack and my statement is true, its not a performance muffler.

Jeff

[Glenn]

[jpaull]

Very cool Glenn. Always good to see people put some real miles on their Vw's. (You woulda had more power with your dual quiet packs or anything else then that single though)

[Glenn]

[jpaull]

Once your exhaust gets to the muffler flange its met all the backpressure it needs providing your header is proper size. This is why someone can run a open stinger on a vw. Annoying as hell but they work.

I ran 5 exhausts an a 1600 stock but dual carbs and lowest restriction had the most power. The single quiet pack was the slowest. Experience is king, if you tried them all and more restriction works for you then great.






[/quote]
I disagree. You need back pressure. Too much flow hurts power.[/quote]
_________________
[email protected] MPH 1/4 Mile & 8.1 @ 83.7MPH in 1/8 Mile with Mild Type 1 VW Mag Case 2234cc commuter engine in stock weight bug w/only .491 total lift(CB2292 Cam), 42x37 heads, 48idf's, Street tires, Belt on, Mufflers, Pump gas, video of the run here: https://youtu.be/M3SPqMOKAOg

Transmission by MCMScott:
Rhino case, Klinkenberg 4.12, Superdiff, 002 mainshaft with 091 first idler. Weddle 1.48 Third & 1.14 Fourth.

[74 Thing]

If you want to use the same merged hideaway muffler then just get a Berg 1 5/8" since the flanges will match up. Al's headers make them so you can look for that.

If you are looking for something different and to make power look at a Mohr stepped header with muffler set up..
http://www.mohrprf.com/products/stepheader.htm

[Glenn]

[bugguy1967]

[bugguy1967]

In one David Vizard book I read, he went so far as to say ZERO back pressure is ideal. The main goal for best performance is to scavenge so well in the engine's operating range that intake charge is pulled in before the exhaust valve fully closes.

[AlteWagen]

Ah the back pressure myth again.

I agree with high velocity with as little back pressure as possible. A restrictive muffler can cause reversion and hurt performance. Its true that anything beyond the collector is just for sound reduction. If the header design, primary tube size/length is optimized for the engine a stinger will work both on the track and street. If a muffler offers little to no back pressure you will not loose power.

On the other hand if the header is too large for the power band a restrictive muffler will make it feel better but its just a bandaid for poor planning.
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[modok]

I don't see the difference. old guys call it backpressure, and new guys call it high velocity. So what, i don't think there has been any progress.

Anyhow, your muffler sucks. The tube between the header and muffler is bigger than both, ans that's your main problem.
If you describe heads and cam of this engine I might be able to guess more

[vugbug68]

[vugbug68]

[Glenn]

[stan_tichomirov]

I don't know, I love running a stinger, but it's just too loud to run. I feel more power up top and hit the rev limiter easier, I don't really feel the loss at lower revs, at least not enough to miss. Can still putt around and climb hills. I'd run it more often but it's just too loud, and can be a hazard (I park on the street often).

Stan
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[modok]

I'm leaning towards I have no clue.
one way to guess at it: 35.5mm exhaust valve try sidewinder, 37.5mm then stay with classic design header (short tubes)

In either case, the mufflers can be improved. IMO, if you can live with the dragging, then the hideaway is a great layout, but, one size muffler does not fit all, so to get best performance you may need to go muffler hunting.