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craigman
Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2004
Posts: 2425
Location: redding
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 Posted: Sat May 14, 2011 2:29 pm Post subject: |
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I personally think squirts would be a great addition to any build. Stock to wild.
I'd love to try them someday. |
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yamaducci
Samba Member
Joined: March 30, 2010
Posts: 2373
Location: Mount Airy, Maryland
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| Posted: Sat May 14, 2011 10:36 am Post subject: |
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| flyinglow94 wrote: |
| So where is the best place to get the Porsche oil squirts? I have looked on line at some Porsche suppliers and didnt see an advertisement on these little things. Does any one have a part # they can share? |
http://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin/smart/more_inf...8%39%29%20
Edit: I had my parts at Brothers Machine but they told me they sub that procedure out.
Not sure but Rimco may have been the guys. I know they have been doing it forever. FAT can do it as well.
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Last edited by yamaducci on Tue May 17, 2011 6:01 am; edited 1 time in total |
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flyinglow94
Samba Member
Joined: January 17, 2005
Posts: 1173
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada
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| Posted: Sat May 14, 2011 10:07 am Post subject: |
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So where is the best place to get the Porsche oil squirts? I have looked on line at some Porsche suppliers and didnt see an advertisement on these little things. Does any one have a part # they can share?
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yamaducci
Samba Member
Joined: March 30, 2010
Posts: 2373
Location: Mount Airy, Maryland
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| Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 6:13 am Post subject: |
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I just had them done on my 2500cc turbo case; should receive it Thursday so no testing yet but I can tell you that the majority of 1600 class desert racing engine have them and don't use a 30,mm pump. Most use 26-28mm. THey steadily run in the 3500-6000RPM range so the pressure is there to make them work well.
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Ian Godfrey
Samba Member
Joined: September 25, 2006
Posts: 1204
Location: Melbourne Australia
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| Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 2:26 am Post subject: |
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Scott, 2387, 175 flywheel hp. heavy ghia, SE heads (less fins) flat out on the curcuit (110mph sustained), 280 F heads on a 100 degree day. all tin etc with 2 mods, ceramic head and piston coating and porsche squirters, really keep the temps down.
I have no back to back testing, but i am very happy with the result. Dakota digital not VDO so very accurate temps. 1600's get hotter than this if you flog them!
I reckon squirters are a logical part of the package IF you need additional cooling in your application. |
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Scott Faivre
Samba Member
Joined: February 26, 2004
Posts: 368
Location: Las Vegas, NV - USA
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| Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 11:17 pm Post subject: |
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...BUMP!
Has the verdict come in on these oil squirters? I'm still on the fence and I'm at the point in my project that if I'm going to do the mod, I need to do it now.
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johnnypan
Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2007
Posts: 7431
Location: sackamenna
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2009 10:49 am Post subject: |
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| Piston coolers are a vital part of heavy diesel technology,just lost #3 piston and liner on a cummins ISX due to a mechanic using too much silicone gasket maker on a oil cooler gasket...silicon got in the oil galley and plugged the "squirter " and the piston seized...Its definately worth the effort to use coolers if you pushing combustion chamber temps beyond the limit ...cheap insurance provided you have enough oil volume... |
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Eaallred
Samba Member
Joined: May 18, 2003
Posts: 5756
Location: West Valley City, Utah
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2009 6:48 am Post subject: |
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The squirters in my 62 Jeep engine are built into the connecting rods and they spray all the time, no pressure limits.
Not so much for cooling though, more just to lubricate. It's an I-4 with over 9" rods. The motor redlines at 3200rpm so there's just not much 'splash oiling' going on way up there in the cylinders. 
I can picture a v-notch in the rod working effectively if done right.
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1961bluebug
Samba Member
Joined: November 11, 2002
Posts: 1137
Location: Czech Republic, Europe
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2009 3:39 am Post subject: |
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can I have some pics of this mod? what would be a correct size for this hole?
Thanks, |
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nsracing
Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2003
Posts: 9743
Location: NOVA
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| Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 11:54 am Post subject: |
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| gblakeney wrote: |
I saw some pistons the other day that had oil holes drilled from the oil ring deck through to the wrist pin boss - looked like a really cool way to divert oil straight to the pin rather than just splash.
Has anyone done this themselves? |
I do them all the time to stock pistons. All it is drill work at the correct angle.
I thought about making several drilling jigs so anyone can do it themselves. Almost all high performance pistons out on the market will have this modification done from factory.
The oil will pressurize the ports when its on its way down..scraping off oil off the cylinder walls.
Simple but neat trick really. |
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propflux01
Samba Member
Joined: June 03, 2006
Posts: 501
Location: Central Arkansastan
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| Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 5:56 am Post subject: |
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| The stock pressure relief system is designed to start relieving pressure at 28PSI. it Will not, however, limit total pressure to that 28psi as there is too much volume and pressure for it to do that, hence why you see that 40+ PSI at speed. It is mainly designed to prevent excess pressure that would occur if it wasn't there. This is why those booster springs work to increase pressure. If you were to remove the spring, and stack a bushing or bunch of washers to prevent the piston from uncovering the sump return port, you would see an amazing amount of oil pressure (provided you didn't blow out your cooler first). |
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A.J.Sims
Banned
Joined: December 11, 2003
Posts: 1016
Location: LowBugget.com 982 N Batavia A4 Orange Ca 92867
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| Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 9:43 pm Post subject: |
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The way i add piston squirters is correct. 
We do all the work in house.
I use to use Rimco for the Porsche style but after some testing i notice that most motors when cruising would not se 45psi all the time or enough to take full advantage.
In my motor I se higher oil temps around 10* but can se 30* and lower head temps. All test were Back to back in the same motor. My turbo motor has them and it has over 45,000 miles on it. when going to Vegas on the Gean Berg cruise up the Baker grade with outside temp at 113* my oil temp was 227*, Sump temp 189*, head temp was 298*. Doug Berg had to look at my temp gun as i pointed it to se how cool the motor was running. I now use our piston squirters in most of the turnkey turbo combos that are trying to push that pump gas edge. It is $120 extra, it was $160 when Rimco was doing the work.
True a hole that is the "wrong size" would bleed off psi. 
PS. If you have crap going through your oil that can block anything, you have other problems!
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Bruce
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Joined: May 16, 2003
Posts: 17583
Location: Left coast, Canada
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| Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 6:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Marty Staggs wrote: |
| Bruce wrote: |
Thanks, you've just saved a bunch of people a whole bunch of money! |
SO mean to say that the motor never sees any more than 28 PSI oil pressure? Are you HIGH???  |
I never said the engine will not see more than 28psi. I just said the squirters won't work. |
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Bruce
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Joined: May 16, 2003
Posts: 17583
Location: Left coast, Canada
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| Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Marty Staggs wrote: |
| Bruce wrote: |
| Anyone know at what pressure does the stock pressure relief valve dump excess pressure to the sump? I think it is below 45psi, rendering the squirters useless. |
You CLEARLY do not know what you are talking about.
On average, your motor will have 10 PSI per 1000 RPM's minimum. Yes the bypasses start to bleed off pressure but they dont stop it at 28PSI.  |
I guess you don't understand how a pressure relief valve works. I have seen that silly 10psi/1000rpm spec people toss around, and it simply can't exist in a hydraulic system that has a pressure relief valve. With a positive displacement pump, if you double the rpm, you double the volume that is pumped. Given a fixed leakage, you will see a doubling of the pressure. However, with a pressure relief valve, the leakage will drastically increase once you hit the relief valve setting, therefore limiting the pressure in the system. The pressure may not hit a solid limit, depending on the volume of the pump, the flow capacity of the relief port and the viscosity of the oil. In other words, it is possible to exceed the pressure rating of the relief valve, but you will never see a linear 10psi/1000rpm.
My claim is that you will never have a continuous 45psi of oil pressure at cruising speed when you want the squirters to be cooling the pistons. |
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vwdmc16
Samba Member
Joined: January 12, 2006
Posts: 1734
Location: sacramento, CA
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| Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 6:04 pm Post subject: |
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heres another approach, on the STF there has bee a great thread about Jonas Linder, a crazy Swede making a sick ass turbo type 4 from scratch and with little money, any who he had a few top end cooling issues so a person by "peumansjoris" suggested some cheap oil squirter ideas, heres the link, it is around half down the page.
http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=88864&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=180
as you'll see the oil is pumped in from the outside, the oil pressure sensor port. so you could turn it on or off easily. the jet could be aimed manually too to get it in the sweet spot.
my idea would be to have a pre set pressure switch (say 45psi?) also on that external line and that could trigger a small solinoid valve to turn the external system on/off and have a manual overide for warm ups or something.
that could solve just about all the problems and on a budget
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bugninva
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Joined: December 14, 2004
Posts: 8858
Location: sound it out.
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| Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Marty Staggs wrote: |
[
And YOU obviously dont have a motor that could or would get any benefit from them. Your motor also sounds a bit "loose" to me.
The only people that would benefit have a performance engine with larger oil pumps that also turn more RPM's.
This would be a modification for a "higher end" type motor and not the typical daily driver or budget project. |
someone forgot to pull the stick out of their ass this morning..... you have to realize that you OBVIOUSLY like blankets statements....such as:
| Marty Staggs wrote: |
You CLEARLY do not know what you are talking about.
On average, your motor will have 10 PSI per 1000 RPM's minimum. Yes the bypasses start to bleed off pressure but they dont stop it at 28PSI. |
maybe you should be more specific on what YOU speak of, instead of adding qualifiers afterwards.... the OP did not specify if his engine was a stocker or a staggs spankin mountain motor....
no need to insult my, actually, very "tight" engine because you are in your own world.... you wanna say you need a big oil pump, fine....but don't be a prick...
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| [email protected] wrote: |
| With a show of hands, who has built over 1000 engines in the last 25 years? Anyone? |
GEX has. Just sayin |
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turbo_bob
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Joined: February 22, 2005
Posts: 293
Location: Victorville CA
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| Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 11:54 am Post subject: |
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Thats why one needs a 30mm pump when using the squirters, you need the extra volume to supply the proper oil pressure.
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turbo_bob
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Joined: February 22, 2005
Posts: 293
Location: Victorville CA
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| Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 11:51 am Post subject: |
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| Marty Staggs wrote: |
| Yes the bypasses start to bleed off pressure but they dont stop it at 28PSI. |
If using the stock springs & pistons it is around 50 PSI to protect the stock oil cooler.
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Marty Staggs
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Joined: October 18, 2003
Posts: 357
Location: So Cal
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| Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2006 11:18 pm Post subject: |
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| bugninva wrote: |
| Marty Staggs wrote: |
| Bruce wrote: |
| Anyone know at what pressure does the stock pressure relief valve dump excess pressure to the sump? I think it is below 45psi, rendering the squirters useless. |
You CLEARLY do not know what you are talking about.
On average, your motor will have 10 PSI per 1000 RPM's minimum. Yes the bypasses start to bleed off pressure but they dont stop it at 28PSI. |
while this is true marty alot of engines don't see the 45psi that the squirters would need to operate when the oil is at operating temperature....mine doesn't....tops out at about 42psi hot....so the relief valve is bleeding off enough to keep the squirters from working in an engine like mine...(and most i've had) |
And YOU obviously dont have a motor that could or would get any benefit from them. Your motor also sounds a bit "loose" to me.
The only people that would benefit have a performance engine with larger oil pumps that also turn more RPM's.
This would be a modification for a "higher end" type motor and not the typical daily driver or budget project.
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nsracing
Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2003
Posts: 9743
Location: NOVA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2006 7:13 pm Post subject: |
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The only way to find out is to make a test and see how much pressure it will take to see the squirt.
All that is needed is a nice piece of tubing and machined to the size of the ID of the main bearings and pump some oil and push some pressure that you can read. Just watch the quality of the squirt and there.
The size of the hole will determine if any pressure drop will be neglegible.
This is a simple drilling operation...nothing more.
I like the hole up high so it will make its trajectory to about middle of the back of the piston. |
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